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popcorn_gif2012-02-01 09:50 am
my_daroga) wrote in popcorn_gif2012-02-01 09:50 am
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[Discussion Post] Citizen Kane
Welcome to our first discussion post! I'm not quite sure how this is going to work--I want everyone to be able to have their say and I don't want to control the conversation. So my plan for now is to post a few questions to get us started, let people talk in comments, and when questions are generated there by all of us I may post again with those collected comments/questions for a new round of discussion. Does that make sense?
So here, anything goes. Observations, feelings, connections to other things you've seen, shallow remarks on actors' looks/voice/shirt collars, disappointments, joys. You can talk about the things you liked and the things you didn't, just please respect one anothers' opinions. By the same token, a lot of these movies are considered among the best (that's why they're on this list) but that doesn't mean you need to think they are--I think we'd all like to know why or why not they should be considered classics.
Without further ado, here are some opening thoughts/questions about Citizen Kane. If you haven't seen it yet don't worry--please feel free to hop in when you're ready. And please use these questions as just a jumping off point, it's not a quiz or anything.
Some background: Orson Welles was 26 when this film was made. He'd already found fame back in New York with his radio broadcasts and as a director: notable works include a Harlem production of Macbeth and The War of the Worlds radio broadcast. He was also the voice of the Shadow! When he came to Hollywood, wooed by studios (and signed by RKO), he had an unprecedented contract which allowed him final cut of the film. This meant that unlike many other directors, and certainly any other untried 20-somethings, he could make the movie he wanted. Much of the cast and crew is drawn from his radio company, and you can see that in the overlapping dialogue style--radio plays were much more likely to make use of layered soundscapes to create depth.
Welles took to filmmaking immediately, likening it to an enormous train set, though it took him awhile to get going. He was a tireless worker when he had a project but had so many ideas he sometimes took a lot of time planning and plotting. When finally Citizen Kane was made, it went over-budget and did not make its money back in release. This led to problems on his next film, The Magnificent Ambersons, and eventually the dissolution of his contract with RKO and one might say the downfall of his entire film career. Now, of course, the film is hailed as a masterpiece but while many critics did like it at the time, it was not always so.
1. What's the relevance of Citizen Kane today? I think the fact of its influence can be clearly seen when you look at something like The Artist, which contains two "homages": the smokey screening room and the breakfast table montage (regardless of their effectiveness in the latter film, they're pretty obvious). Why is this? Why does it continue to top critics' lists and film school syllabi? Do you see its influence in other movies?
2. As an addendum, do you think it deserves this place? Why or why not? What can you see in this film that might have been different at the time? Is it really a great film, or is it riding on some critical reputation? Do you enjoy it as a film, or is it merely of interest because everyone says so? Do we NEED a "best movie ever made" or is this question totally irrelevant?
3. Structure: How does it work to have the narrative of his life told at the
beginning through the newsreel--to watch the film knowing his first wife dies, that he
doesn't get elected, dies alone, etc? Does it remove suspense, or does it alter the suspense to discovering how these pieces fit together? Does the structure add to the themes of the film? Why do you think they chose to tell the story this way, when most films of the time were very straightforward?
4. Speaking of which: "Rosebud." The key to the man, brilliant MacGuffin, or awkward narrative device? And does it matter?
5. What techniques do you recognize in other films? If you've watched
other films from this time period, does it seem like them or not? Can you see elements of the theater and radio in the way the film is made?
5a.Gregg Toland, cinematographer, used this film to work out a lot of techniques and theories of his, mostly pertaining to "deep focus" or the practice of keeping everything in frame in focus instead of directing the eye to a particular portion of the screen. He claimed this was a more "natural" style, while others might state that the human eye does not actually see everything in focus all at once. What do you think? How do you feel about the "look" of the movie?
5b. The breakfast table sequence is often hailed as a masterpiece of montage for its succinct telling of the dissolution of a relationship. Were there other scenes or transitions that used cinematic elements for interesting storytelling effect?
6. "If I hadn't been very rich, I might have been a really great man." Orson Welles himself said that Kane was “a very great man and a mediocre individual.” How do you feel about Kane, in the end?
7. What is/are the theme(s) of the movie? Do you think it explores them well? Why or why not?
8. What's your favorite Citizen Kane parody?
9. Discuss the acting. Does it seem natural/stagy/forced/easy/challenging/etc to you? Did you have a favorite performance?
10. Can you separate the movie from the reputation? What were your first responses? Do your feelings change when you learn more about a movie like this? Does the reputation enhance or hinder your enjoyment?
11. Will you be seeking out other Welles films? Or if you have already, where do you put this in his ouvre? Do you have a favorite film of his? How do you feel about him as an actor vs. a director?
And of course, feel free to ignore those, ask your own questions, babble about your feelings, or sit back and enjoy the discussion! And let me know what I can do to make this better.
So here, anything goes. Observations, feelings, connections to other things you've seen, shallow remarks on actors' looks/voice/shirt collars, disappointments, joys. You can talk about the things you liked and the things you didn't, just please respect one anothers' opinions. By the same token, a lot of these movies are considered among the best (that's why they're on this list) but that doesn't mean you need to think they are--I think we'd all like to know why or why not they should be considered classics.
Without further ado, here are some opening thoughts/questions about Citizen Kane. If you haven't seen it yet don't worry--please feel free to hop in when you're ready. And please use these questions as just a jumping off point, it's not a quiz or anything.
Some background: Orson Welles was 26 when this film was made. He'd already found fame back in New York with his radio broadcasts and as a director: notable works include a Harlem production of Macbeth and The War of the Worlds radio broadcast. He was also the voice of the Shadow! When he came to Hollywood, wooed by studios (and signed by RKO), he had an unprecedented contract which allowed him final cut of the film. This meant that unlike many other directors, and certainly any other untried 20-somethings, he could make the movie he wanted. Much of the cast and crew is drawn from his radio company, and you can see that in the overlapping dialogue style--radio plays were much more likely to make use of layered soundscapes to create depth.
Welles took to filmmaking immediately, likening it to an enormous train set, though it took him awhile to get going. He was a tireless worker when he had a project but had so many ideas he sometimes took a lot of time planning and plotting. When finally Citizen Kane was made, it went over-budget and did not make its money back in release. This led to problems on his next film, The Magnificent Ambersons, and eventually the dissolution of his contract with RKO and one might say the downfall of his entire film career. Now, of course, the film is hailed as a masterpiece but while many critics did like it at the time, it was not always so.
1. What's the relevance of Citizen Kane today? I think the fact of its influence can be clearly seen when you look at something like The Artist, which contains two "homages": the smokey screening room and the breakfast table montage (regardless of their effectiveness in the latter film, they're pretty obvious). Why is this? Why does it continue to top critics' lists and film school syllabi? Do you see its influence in other movies?
2. As an addendum, do you think it deserves this place? Why or why not? What can you see in this film that might have been different at the time? Is it really a great film, or is it riding on some critical reputation? Do you enjoy it as a film, or is it merely of interest because everyone says so? Do we NEED a "best movie ever made" or is this question totally irrelevant?
3. Structure: How does it work to have the narrative of his life told at the
beginning through the newsreel--to watch the film knowing his first wife dies, that he
doesn't get elected, dies alone, etc? Does it remove suspense, or does it alter the suspense to discovering how these pieces fit together? Does the structure add to the themes of the film? Why do you think they chose to tell the story this way, when most films of the time were very straightforward?
4. Speaking of which: "Rosebud." The key to the man, brilliant MacGuffin, or awkward narrative device? And does it matter?
5. What techniques do you recognize in other films? If you've watched
other films from this time period, does it seem like them or not? Can you see elements of the theater and radio in the way the film is made?
5a.Gregg Toland, cinematographer, used this film to work out a lot of techniques and theories of his, mostly pertaining to "deep focus" or the practice of keeping everything in frame in focus instead of directing the eye to a particular portion of the screen. He claimed this was a more "natural" style, while others might state that the human eye does not actually see everything in focus all at once. What do you think? How do you feel about the "look" of the movie?
5b. The breakfast table sequence is often hailed as a masterpiece of montage for its succinct telling of the dissolution of a relationship. Were there other scenes or transitions that used cinematic elements for interesting storytelling effect?
6. "If I hadn't been very rich, I might have been a really great man." Orson Welles himself said that Kane was “a very great man and a mediocre individual.” How do you feel about Kane, in the end?
7. What is/are the theme(s) of the movie? Do you think it explores them well? Why or why not?
8. What's your favorite Citizen Kane parody?
9. Discuss the acting. Does it seem natural/stagy/forced/easy/challenging/etc to you? Did you have a favorite performance?
10. Can you separate the movie from the reputation? What were your first responses? Do your feelings change when you learn more about a movie like this? Does the reputation enhance or hinder your enjoyment?
11. Will you be seeking out other Welles films? Or if you have already, where do you put this in his ouvre? Do you have a favorite film of his? How do you feel about him as an actor vs. a director?
And of course, feel free to ignore those, ask your own questions, babble about your feelings, or sit back and enjoy the discussion! And let me know what I can do to make this better.